Napoleon Dynamite vs Rushmore

Ryan: Is it wrong to hate a movie because it's ugly?

Cliff: Is it shallow?

Ryan: I know it's shallow. Is it wrong?

Cliff: Shallow isn't necessarily wrong.

Ryan: Hm.

Cliff: Maybe if I had an example.

Ryan: I just think if movies are going to be ugly, then fine, but the ugly people better have something to say.

Cliff: And if it has nothing to say?

Ryan: Then it should be pleasant to look at.

Cliff: Examples?

Ryan: Well, no one in A Mighty Wind is exactly easy on the eyes.

Cliff: No. But they're funny.

Ryan: See? You ever see All the Real Girls?

Cliff: No.

Ryan: Oh. Well you probably should. It's pretty good.

Cliff: And ugly?

Ryan: It's the ugliest. Ugly setting, ugly homes, ugly people.

Cliff: Except Zooey Deschanel.

Ryan: Yeah, but as soon as possible, they give her a bad haircut.

Cliff: Cause she's a real girl.

Ryan: Yes.

Cliff: And she has stuff to say.

Ryan: Yes. And because she's not, like, lit perfectly, or dressed completely flattering, we buy her as less than a movie star.

Cliff: Well, she's not a movie star, really.

Ryan: But you see the point. All the Real Girls has a lot to say about making do, and finding yourself, and being able to show that self to others, before, you know, you die unhappily.

Cliff: Is that the movie we're talking about?

Ryan: It wasn't supposed to be.

Cliff: I'm guessing it's ugly.

Ryan: I fucking hate Napoleon Dynamite.

Cliff: Well, the chase has been cut. To. What's the past-tense of cutting to the chase?

Ryan: Fuck Napoleon Dynamite.

Cliff: So, you're not going to be buying a “Pedro for President” t-shirt?

Ryan: Boo.

Cliff: I think you're in the minority here.

Ryan: I refuse to believe that. Tell me you like Napoleon Dynamite.

Cliff: Not much. It reminded me too much of commercials. It looks like the chocolate milk commercials. You know, the kids in the retro, wood-paneled rec room, shaking up the milk.

Ryan: Yeah. Boo.

Cliff: And a little like the Orbitz gum commercials with the flight attendant or whatever.

Ryan: Yeah, I can see that. Boo.

Cliff: And it looks a little like those old Calvin Klein heroin ads that were all porno and Seventies and anorexic. Only it doesn't rock like those commercials did.

Ryan: No. Not that those commercials rocked.

Cliff: Of course not. Except, you know, they did. Unshowered models are pretty rockin'.

Ryan: Calvin Klein might just be the only person who sells cologne for the purpose of covering up other smells.

Cliff: No, I'm sure Britney's cologne serves the same function.

Ryan: Anyway, explain to me, please, the appeal of Napoleon Dynamite.

Cliff: Well, it's funny, in theory. This loser guy, who everybody picks on, being sort of a hero.

Ryan: But what's he the hero of?

Cliff: Well…he campaigns for his only friend to be class president or whatever. And he…I think people just think he's funny because he has such a bad temper.

Ryan: Apparently his dancing is popular too.

Cliff: Yeah. And he has an alpaca or llama or something named Tina. It's kitschy.

Ryan: See, here's the deal: It's fabricated sarcasm. It isn't sarcasm in the face of anything, or as a response to anything. We're just supposed to laugh at Napoleon Dynamite because he exists, and isn't he funny, even though he hasn't done a damn thing. It's ironically ugly, like those commercials, or like when people overdo it at a thrift store, like they want to dress ugly, but it's like if you don't like their ugly thrift clothes, it's because you just didn't get it. Napoleon Dynamite defines itself completely by being retro and intentionally stupid, without letting its characters in on the joke. Napoleon is barely self-aware at all, yet how could he not be, with his head being bashed into the lockers every day? How could he not see himself at all? If you took away all the ugly, and all the pretend irony, and just focused on the script and performances, what would you have?

Cliff: A G-Rated, two-hour Strangers With Candy.

Ryan: That sound like fun to you?

Cliff: Not go-out-and-buy-a-T-shirt fun, no.

Ryan: So why has it caught on?

Cliff: Because everybody gets to be the bully. You can't be a bully in real life, because you'd be hated, and you'd be leaving scars behind everywhere you went, and your ulcer would wake you up every morning, and you'd like, aspire to hosting a reality show or having your own hip-hop squad, but really you'd just be one of those awful people I always wind up dealing with.

Ryan: Where?

Cliff: Anywhere I'm getting a service I could conceivably perform myself, like teeth-cleaning or oil-changing. Smug assholes.

Ryan: So, millions love Napoleon Dynamite because it presents a safe environment for scorning some loser?

Cliff: Yes.

Ryan: Which is largely what I've done.

Cliff: Yes.

Ryan: So…I loved Napoleon Dynamite?

Cliff: A little. Probably, you loved him the equal amount that you hate yourself.

Ryan: I could never love him that much.

Cliff: So, you hated it. We all hated it. What movie do you think does what Napoleon Dynamite tried to do, without pissing you off?

Ryan: And the loser girl with the side ponytail, who runs the Glamourshots studio or something. She's only there to be made fun of. She's not even a character. She's just a solitary characteristic.

Cliff: Yes. You're being very clear. We get it. Napoleon Dynamite is bad. What movie is good?

Ryan: And have you read interviews with the filmmakers? Saying they didn't know Napoleon Dynamite was the name of a song? Bullshit.

Cliff: Yes. But there is a good movie to talk about, right? Come on, buddy, towards the light.

Ryan: Rushmore.

Cliff: Yes.

Ryan: What is Napoleon Dynamite but Rushmore for the stupid?

Cliff: Rushmore is good. It's so good.

Ryan: Yeah.

Cliff: No, seriously. It's better than you remember even. And not just comparatively speaking. It's good even without watching crap first.

Ryan: See, Max is a loser, in a way, but he's ambitious. He's focused. Even if we don't like him at first, we sort of secretly admire him. He's human. He's not just that one thing.

Cliff: Right. And he's angry about actual things. His situation, his relationship with his father, is so specific and genuine. We know Max has something to lose.

Ryan: And all the stuff with him and Bill Murray. Don't even get me started. That friendship based on mutual admiration, but with hardly any affection.

Cliff: It's a smart movie. It's really good.

Ryan: It's good and it's funny, and when it's ironic, there's actual irony involved. And when it's ugly, it's beautiful.

Cliff: And if you love Rushmore, it's guilt-free.

Ryan: You know at the end when everyone's dancing? After the play?

Cliff: Yeah.

Ryan: Yeah.

Cliff: What?

Ryan: Nothing. It's just really sweet.

Cliff: Yeah.

Ryan: And Bill Murray is in Rushmore. Bill Murray is not in Napoleon Dynamite.

Cliff: No. No he isn't. Wes Anderson is a smart guy. Everybody in Rushmore has a heart and a brain.

Ryan: There it is. That's the difference. Napoleon Dynamite has neither. Maybe it assumes the audience will, and that we'll project something onto it.

Cliff: A lot of that should really be done for us, before we sit down in the theater.

Ryan: And that dinner scene? When Max's teacher brings Luke Wilson to the restaurant?

Cliff: Yeah, I know: It's a good movie. I think we're done here.

Napoleon Dynamite: D
Rushmore: A