X-Men: Last Stand vs Alien 3

Ryan: So, we’re supposed to hate X-Men 3, right?

Cliff: Yes. It says to on the internet.

Ryan: Why are we supposed to hate it, again? I can’t remember.

Cliff: Ratner.

Ryan: Oh yeah, Brett Ratner was supposed to screw it up and we were all gonna hate him for screwing it up and making it all Ratner, the same way Schumacher made Batman and Robin all Schumacher.

Cliff: SHUUUUMMAAAAACHERR!

Ryan: But does Ratner have his own identity as a director? I mean, Schumacher is all day-glow and curtains blowing around and like teens dancing in warehouses or whatever. Schumacher’s got a certain vibe that you can spot instantly. Does Ratner have that?

Cliff: I never noticed it. The Rush Hour movies look like everything else to me. They look like the Lethal Weapon movies, kind of, and I guess a little like…I dunno, Beverly Hills Cop or something. It’s just nice suits and wet streets and snappy soundtracks and stuff.

Ryan: Yeah, he’s just kind of a journeyman director. You know, how Law and Order looks the exact same every week, but it’s got like ten directors a season. Brett Ratner could probably come in and direct Law and Order, and you’d never notice, because it would look just like Law and Order. Martin Scorsese directs Law and Order, you’d notice. Now, probably what would happen is that Law and Order would kick ass like never before for that one week, but you know what? It wouldn’t be Law and Order anymore, and that would be a problem for a lot of us. And if you’re expecting Martin Scorsese the week after, then you’ve got a whole different problem. But if you’re expecting, say…

Cliff: Bryan Singer…

Ryan: Exactly. I’m just gonna put this out there. I really, really liked the first two X-Men movies. Maybe I even loved them. I’ve certainly watched them enough. But I’ll tell you, if they’ve got a visual style of their own, I’ve never seen it. And if there’s any unique camera thing, or editing thing, or pacing thing happening, you’d never know it had anything to do with the director. Cause it’s pretty standard action movie stuff. We’re not talking Tim Burton’s Gotham City here, you know? There’s not exactly a signature on the X-Men movies. They were directed by a capable, journeyman director. And if he’s gone, it really just takes another pro to step in and keep everybody on task. Any of the Law and Order guys, for example, could do the trick. If you got someone with big-budget movie experience, then all the better, right?

Cliff: Should we just say that we loved it? Haven’t we cleared Ratner enough already?

Ryan: Yeah, I think so. He came in late, kept everything on its toes, and made, I think, a good movie.

Cliff: As good as the first two?

Ryan: MORE. Just kidding.

Cliff: So can we finally talk about the damn thing?

Ryan: My pleasure.

Cliff: Jean Grey is alive, a couple other X-Men aren’t, and there’s a cure for mutants out there that has split the mutant community in half. Magneto and the Brotherhood on one side, Professor X and the X-Men on the other.

Ryan: There’s a bit more characterization this time around, I think. Especially with Jean Grey.

Cliff: I loved every scene with Jean Grey this time.  I wish Anakin Skywalker’s character arc could have been as interesting as Jean Grey’s. The first scene where she finally lets the Phoenix overtake her is crazy good.

Ryan: I didn’t expect that scene to be so powerful. It’s the sort of thing that usually happens at the end of a movie like this.

Cliff: And Magneto assembling his team is another well-done scene. It’s played for laughs at first, and then they have to deal with the cure firsthand, and well, it’s a perfect Magneto moment.

Ryan: It’s one the audience isn’t gonna like.

Cliff: Yeah, but Magneto is a bit like Hannibal Lecter. You’re so distracted by his manners and eloquence that you get lulled into that false charm. It’s important to be snapped back into reality like that. Magneto has a mission; don’t get in the way.

Ryan: Good special effects this time around too, huh? Wolverine and Beast have some serious fighting in this one, and nothing looked too wirey or stunty.

Cliff: Yeah, and they stepped up some for Storm. Oh shit, and Kitty Pryde. I almost forgot Kitty Pryde

Ryan: And your favorite…

Cliff: JUGGERNAUT!

Ryan: Your voice actually echoes when you say that.

Cliff: And I don’t wanna spoil too much here, but there’s a character who does a significant amount of killing in this movie, and the victims go in a spectacular way.

Ryan: Yes. It’s cribbed from War of the Worlds, but it freaked me out in that, and it freaked me out in this one as well. I have to say, as much as I liked the others, there’s an emotional investment in the characters that I brought with me this time, and I was on edge the entire time, especially once I saw that pretty much anyone could die. When…the person who did all the killing would attack, I was so close to the edge of my seat I was practically standing.

Cliff: Yeah, I never knew when she was gonna turn. I mean, uh, spoiler.

Ryan: Careful.

Cliff: You know, there’s a comic book thing that’s happening here that I’m not sure everybody gets.

Ryan: Like what?

Cliff: Well, the quick origins, for one, with Jean Grey and Angel. And the dialogue during heavy action scenes. Usually in movies, no one talks during action scenes, but in comics they always do, and they did in X-Men 3 the entire time. The Danger Room, the stuff at the end.

Ryan: See, that’s why I come to you for the comic book stuff.

Cliff: And all the stuff in the Grey family house. That’s straight out of a comic book. The house rising off the ground, Wolverine up on the ceiling, the hairs on Professor X’s arms flying off. That’s all stuff we’d take for granted on a comic page, but we never get it at all in a movie. And Colossus grabbing Rogue’s head to lend her power, and the fastball with Wolverine. That’s stuff right off the comic page, as literally as possible, and I just appreciate it so much. I don’t read much besides comic books, so this hardly ever happens to me. I don’t know if The Da Vinci Code got any little things right because I didn’t read that shit.

Ryan: Oh jeez, me either.

Cliff: That’s a hair-dryer book.

Ryan: What?

Cliff: You know, like old ladies under those huge conehead hair dryers.

Ryan: Okay, so here’s your chance. What’s your favorite thing that a comic reader would get that a regular movie-goer would not? Cause some scenes and characters and jokes are just for you, you know.

Cliff: Well the best part, I think, is that it holds together if you’ve seen the others. But there’s definitely stuff there just for the comic readers. Multiple Man was a big one. Not only is that actor identical to the comic version, his power worked exactly like you’d think it would live-action. Mainly it’s just the overall tone. The truck with the mutants behind the walls, the bridge moving across the bay, Pyro and Iceman facing off. It’s not so much that it’s a comic book come to life; it’s more that the comic book was real all along, and we’re getting to see it at the source.

Ryan: So what you’re really saying is that Brett Ratner might actually have a visual style all his own, and that his voice and talent might be all over X-Men 3?

Cliff: Maybe. Might have to let him direct another just to be sure.

Ryan: So, it’s perfect? No problems?

Cliff: Well, I figure there’s a standard for this sort of thing. For me, it’s the second Spider-man, the second X-Men, Batman Begins. With Spider-man and Batman, you’re dealing on a much different scale. You’ve got one guy who’s got to represent all these hopes and fears and dreams of other characters, and who has to be a heightened version of everyone else’s reality. With X-Men, there’s a ton more characters, and they all exist on the same plane. No one is astounded by anyone else. They’re all impressive, so you have to view them as just part of their own reality, and not wonder, you know, what it would be like to look out the window and see Spider-man swing by. In the world of the X-Men, Beast is scary to some people, but he’s not new, and he’s barely a novelty. So, there are problems, always, but it’s hard to nitpick about them, because it’s a wonder any of it works in the first place.

Ryan: You can tell me. I insist. Seriously, I’m willing to be won over by Ratner, but I’m not gonna kiss his ass or anything.

Cliff: Well, Rogue has never really been given the storyline she deserves. They probably could have switched her and Kitty Pryde, in terms of overall exposure, and told the same story. And they used Angel to sell this movie in every commercial, and then he’s barely in it. I’m not sure if that was always the case, or if it’s editing or what.

Ryan: Well, he looks cool, he satisfies a certain comic book demographic, and he’s a nice visual metaphor for the cure storyline. They couldn’t use one of the ugly mutants to illustrate the appeal of keeping your powers. It’s gotta be the angel. Pretty sure we’ll see him again.

Cliff: And it pains me a little to see Mystique getting pushed to the sidelines like that, even though she’s vital to all three movies.

Ryan: And for those of us who haven’t read all five hundred X-Men comics published each month, I could have stood to hear the characters call each other by their names a bit more. Or at all.

Cliff: Like who?

Ryan: Well, if I could answer that, it wouldn’t be a problem. Hardly any of the bad-guys were named, so I had to do it myself: Fast-girl, Tattoo Face, Fatty/Skinny, Porcupine, Ashy, Sticky, Purple. Should I go on?

Cliff: I’ll fill you in later.

Ryan: You didn’t know them all either. There’s no way.

Cliff: You’d be surprised.

Ryan: Moving on. So what do you want to watch now?

Cliff: I dunno, what else was supposed to suck that we liked?

Ryan: Hannibal?

Cliff: I said “supposed to suck” not “actually sucked”.

Ryan: So, I’m alone in that one?

Cliff: You, sir, are definitely alone. For real. Yikes.

Ryan: Alien 3.

Cliff: That’s a little closer. I’ve seen it a few times, and it’s always more satisfying than I think it’s gonna be. And the Ripley as martyr thing is just about as Jean Grey as you can get.

Ryan: Yeah, all that kill me before I kill all of you stuff.

Cliff: I would watch it again, if I had to.

Ryan: I actually like it quite a bit. I’m not sure if that’s a failing of mine, or if it’s a positive: I seem to go for downer movies that piss other people off. Sigourney Weaver has been asked to play four different versions of that character, and she’s nailed it every time.

Cliff: There’s got to be some way to edit those last two Alien movies into one great sequel. It’s not even that I would change the ending, necessarily, I’d just make getting there more worth it. She kills herself in that awesome swan dive into the fire, but she only threw down with one little alien as a send-off? I wanted her going down swinging, fighting off a herd of those bastards.

Ryan: Charles S. Dutton is good too. I love the funeral at the beginning.

Cliff: You love all the shit other people hate. That’s a heavy moment. I think people still thought it might be fun at that point, but when Charles S. Dutton is giving a eulogy while an alien is bursting out of the chest of a dog, I’m pretty sure people are leaving the theater.

Ryan: Except me.

Cliff: Perv.

Ryan: I’m loathe to admit that the real problem with Alien 3 is the reason X-Men 3 succeeds. Alien 3 is too unique.

Cliff: How much time a year do you spend complaining that all movies look alike and that no one has their own voice anymore? Seven months? Eight? At least all the months with no snow, you’re bitching about bland movies.

Ryan: I know. It kills me. But David Fincher tried too hard to put his stamp on a story that was two-thirds told already. He should have just gone with the flow a little and wrapped it up. But he had to go and make the artistic statement. I guess he didn’t know he’d have time later.

Cliff: And that’s where Ratner trumps him. He knows that when you’re working at McDonalds, you gotta make the nuggets like they’ve always been made, even if you can whip up some kind of crazy nugget surprise at your place that all your friends love and are always asking you to make for Super Bowl Sunday.

Ryan: What does that mean?

Cliff: At McDonald’s, you want McDonald’s. At X-Men, you want X-Men. At Alien you want Alien. You don’t want David Fincher’s Alien, even if it zips around on the ceiling and lives with Charles S. Dutton and Pete Postlethwaite. It’s too specific.

Ryan: So Brett Ratner’s X-Men?

Cliff: Oh, that woulda sucked. Hard.

Ryan: But X-Men, directed by Brett Ratner?

Cliff: Don’t tell anyone, but I liked it.

Ryan: Our secret.

X-Men: The Last Stand: B
Alien 3: B-